We Must Believe in the Fundamental Goodness of Our Natural Desires
In any bad habit there are two things:
1) the disorder and
2) the natural desire that is trying to express itself through that disorder. If people don't feel loved, they eat too much, they become gluttons. It is true that they are gluttons, but it is also true that they don’t feel loved. A homosexual is searching for the love of a father. You could say he is perverse, or hopeless, or has to learn to live with it, but what needs to be said is that we have natural desires, that the power of these natural desires can be fulfilled in Christ, and that this drive towards fulfillment exists together with the perversity that moves us to try to satisfy these desires in a sinful way.
COMMENT: We say though that fasting and self-denial are desirable, so we must need some mortification of natural desires.
All that is good if you fundamentally believe you love God and are loved by Him because then you would mortify yourself motivated by the conviction that God loves you. But if you believe you love evil and have to overcome evil yourself, to mortify yourself is psychopathic. What it comes down to is that you try to buy love by not eating a piece of cake!
COMMENT: What does it mean when we read in St. Paul, "to fill up those things that are wanting in the suffering of Christ"?(Col 1:24)
You fill them up plenty because when you love God you let Him do what He wants with you. But to be preoccupied with suffering as though it came from you is wrong. Suffering is good if it is motivated by God's love, but to suffer in order to buy love is sick, and this is the thing that makes psychiatrists say that religion is psychopathic. If you look at yourself you’ll see that all your life you thought you loved evil as evil, and therefore when you would sin you would say, in effect, there it is again.
COMMENT: Does your joy come because you're convinced your will is in God?
There are two things: intellectually, there is the proof of the power of God's mercy, but psychologically there has to be the conviction of achieving your heart's desire. You can hardly feel the effects of God's mercy if you are convinced that everything you want is evil. Without the removal of the psychological impediment you’re impervious to the love of God. You have to be convinced that it is natural to want what is good and that by God's mercy you’re able to have it. You have to realize that you desire God, that through Christ you have the power to reach Him, and that sin is God’s plan for drawing you closer to Him.
It is pretty important to recognize the need for that conviction in yourself and to believe in that natural desire for God. Then you can understand the effects of that desire on the emotions. If you're attracted to impurity, it means you have the need for God Who is ecstasy. Your impurity doesn't keep you from God. Rather, He permits it to purify you through your very impurity. When you see what you are in yourself, you go to Him in order to cleave to Him more closely. In this way, you don't deny sin, you don't harden yourself to it, and yet you're objective about it. And in this way you form a right conscience.
COMMENT: That means you don't worry about the attraction to evil. Is that right?
By nature you desire God and by your participation in His divine life, you're able to attain Him. At the same time there is the emotional attraction to evil, but it doesn't affect your substantial attraction to God.
COMMENT: We don't realize that our lack of faith in God is worse than the evil.
That's right, and Judas went to hell because of that lack of faith. It is very important to realize that the mercy of God can't have any reality to you unless you enjoy it yourself. It is very important to see that all your perversity is the deviation of something which is natural because of the frustration of that natural desire.
COMMENT: God is making you just, but at the same time...
He leaves you with the inclination to evil. The meaning of sin and temptation positively is God showing you what you are in yourself in order to draw you to Him. He permitted sin; just as He gave the Holy Virgin a sinless life, He gives us a life with an inclination to sin in order to draw us to Himself. But the devil would always try to convince you that your evil was too much for God. Ask yourself if you haven't believed that all your life.
St. Augustine said, "The heart is made for Thee, and has no rest until it rests in Thee." It isn't by elevation to divine life alone that we have a desire for God, it is a natural desire. Our participation in God's divine life enables us to fulfill that desire more perfectly. So you've got to believe in the fundamental goodness of your desires and that your perversity is nothing - relatively, that is, in comparison with God's love. Believing this generates hope and also objectivity, because you can see the thing the way it is. But if you don't believe this, you would be afraid to face the truth and would start looking at the sins of others in order to console yourself.
You hate sin in itself, but in a sense you love it, as loving God's will to leave you with it. It is not the sin you love, but God's will. And the proof that you have the right disposition is that you turn away from the sin.
COMMENT: So when I fall I believe that God's goodness is mine.
You can know what a truth is without knowing its properties. You can know the mercy of God without knowing that its effect is to rectify your natural desire for God. So if you don't believe in the natural goodness of your actions, you can't believe in God's mercy, because it might still seem that His mercy couldn't rectify your actions. So our elevation to the divine life is the fulfillment of nature. If you deny our participation in God's divine life, you can't fulfill nature.
COMMENT: We always thought of this participation in the divine life as something extraneous.
This participation makes the fulfillment of your natural desires more complete.
COMMENT: Participation in God’s divine life doesn't make any sense at all if you don't believe you have those natural desires.
If you don't have these natural desires, you don't have anything in you which is receptive to God's life. The reality of God's mercy is that He is directing your natural desires to Him more and more completely, and He permits your evil as a way of drawing you. That is the meaning of sin.
COMMENT: We were always forced to be good because we thought our natural desires were bad.
It is very important to rectify your conscience and to believe in yourself, because if you think what you want is fundamentally evil, you won't look at yourself as an object of faith. This is also the secret of fraternal charity, because when you look at yourself that way, you look at your neighbor in the same way. But if you try to support yourself with that muted despair, you’ll consciously or unconsciously try to see that your neighbor is the same way or worse. Remember Jesus said, "Cast the beam out of your own eye and then you will know how to heal your neighbor."(Mt 7:5; Lk 6:42)
COMMENT: You really use psychology in explaining things to us. Psychiatrists explain it, but they can't do anything about it.
They're trying to convince you that you're alright in yourself. The right conclusion should be that with the grace of God you can become right. But what we have is psychology without faith and faith without psychology.
COMMENT: The point is that even though it is true that my natural desires are good, I have done cockeyed things and there is still the fact that I like to do those things.
What is "natural" is good in the sense that your desire for God is good. A homosexual is looking for the love of a father, and naturally the love of a father is good. But in psychiatry the whole operation is neurotic, because the psychiatrist cooperates in repressing the evil, whereas in the faith you can handle the evil, because with the help of God's grace, you rectify the natural desire for good and in Jesus fulfill those very desires.
COMMENT: People say there is a fundamental goodness in man and then they go beyond that and say that they can do it themselves; they would deny our fallen nature.
If they were able to do this, to deny our fallen nature, it would make Christ unnecessary. If we could be good without elevation to God's divine nature, why would he have had to die on the Cross? The process by which we become holy is through sin and the acknowledgement of sin. If you don't see that you're a sinner and fallen in yourself, then what would stop you from just resting in yourself? On the other hand, if you see that you're just evil, why try? The only right resolution is to believe in the fundamental goodness of your natural appetite, that you really want to love God and your neighbor, and that Christ makes it possible. You realize by this objectivity how you are fallen in yourself, and at the same time you believe that Christ is enabling you to fulfill your natural desires.
If we look at the whole breakdown of morality in our time, I think God lets that happen to teach us the things we’re learning here: this idea of believing in your own goodness, in Jesus, and in the goodness of your natural desires. You have to believe in the rightness and goodness of your natural desires and that they can be fulfilled in Christ. Then the meaning of your perversity is simply to bring you closer to Jesus. Otherwise you’ll conclude that you want evil and so you’ll do it.
COMMENT: Is each moment, then, the divine life that Jesus is offering us to fulfill those natural desires? That's really a great way to look at it! I never saw it that way before.
There is a story about three monks, and they wanted to find out which one was a saint, so they asked them what they would do if they knew they were going to die. The first one said he would go to the chapel and pray; the second one said he would examine his conscience and go to confession; but the third one said he would go on doing whatever he was doing - he was the saint.
Believing in yourself also gives you that dignity and self-respect. Ask yourself how much of what you do is to sell yourself to others. Also, ask yourself why you look for evil in others.
COMMENT: When you believe in yourself you really want to stay in Jesus.
You don't say, I'm going to stay recollected. You know that if you're not recollected. you’ll get in trouble. With the real sinner the only trouble with temptation is that it doesn't last long enough! But when you live in Jesus, you want the good He wants and all your natural desires are fulfilled in Him.
1) the disorder and
2) the natural desire that is trying to express itself through that disorder. If people don't feel loved, they eat too much, they become gluttons. It is true that they are gluttons, but it is also true that they don’t feel loved. A homosexual is searching for the love of a father. You could say he is perverse, or hopeless, or has to learn to live with it, but what needs to be said is that we have natural desires, that the power of these natural desires can be fulfilled in Christ, and that this drive towards fulfillment exists together with the perversity that moves us to try to satisfy these desires in a sinful way.
COMMENT: We say though that fasting and self-denial are desirable, so we must need some mortification of natural desires.
All that is good if you fundamentally believe you love God and are loved by Him because then you would mortify yourself motivated by the conviction that God loves you. But if you believe you love evil and have to overcome evil yourself, to mortify yourself is psychopathic. What it comes down to is that you try to buy love by not eating a piece of cake!
COMMENT: What does it mean when we read in St. Paul, "to fill up those things that are wanting in the suffering of Christ"?(Col 1:24)
You fill them up plenty because when you love God you let Him do what He wants with you. But to be preoccupied with suffering as though it came from you is wrong. Suffering is good if it is motivated by God's love, but to suffer in order to buy love is sick, and this is the thing that makes psychiatrists say that religion is psychopathic. If you look at yourself you’ll see that all your life you thought you loved evil as evil, and therefore when you would sin you would say, in effect, there it is again.
COMMENT: Does your joy come because you're convinced your will is in God?
There are two things: intellectually, there is the proof of the power of God's mercy, but psychologically there has to be the conviction of achieving your heart's desire. You can hardly feel the effects of God's mercy if you are convinced that everything you want is evil. Without the removal of the psychological impediment you’re impervious to the love of God. You have to be convinced that it is natural to want what is good and that by God's mercy you’re able to have it. You have to realize that you desire God, that through Christ you have the power to reach Him, and that sin is God’s plan for drawing you closer to Him.
It is pretty important to recognize the need for that conviction in yourself and to believe in that natural desire for God. Then you can understand the effects of that desire on the emotions. If you're attracted to impurity, it means you have the need for God Who is ecstasy. Your impurity doesn't keep you from God. Rather, He permits it to purify you through your very impurity. When you see what you are in yourself, you go to Him in order to cleave to Him more closely. In this way, you don't deny sin, you don't harden yourself to it, and yet you're objective about it. And in this way you form a right conscience.
COMMENT: That means you don't worry about the attraction to evil. Is that right?
By nature you desire God and by your participation in His divine life, you're able to attain Him. At the same time there is the emotional attraction to evil, but it doesn't affect your substantial attraction to God.
COMMENT: We don't realize that our lack of faith in God is worse than the evil.
That's right, and Judas went to hell because of that lack of faith. It is very important to realize that the mercy of God can't have any reality to you unless you enjoy it yourself. It is very important to see that all your perversity is the deviation of something which is natural because of the frustration of that natural desire.
COMMENT: God is making you just, but at the same time...
He leaves you with the inclination to evil. The meaning of sin and temptation positively is God showing you what you are in yourself in order to draw you to Him. He permitted sin; just as He gave the Holy Virgin a sinless life, He gives us a life with an inclination to sin in order to draw us to Himself. But the devil would always try to convince you that your evil was too much for God. Ask yourself if you haven't believed that all your life.
St. Augustine said, "The heart is made for Thee, and has no rest until it rests in Thee." It isn't by elevation to divine life alone that we have a desire for God, it is a natural desire. Our participation in God's divine life enables us to fulfill that desire more perfectly. So you've got to believe in the fundamental goodness of your desires and that your perversity is nothing - relatively, that is, in comparison with God's love. Believing this generates hope and also objectivity, because you can see the thing the way it is. But if you don't believe this, you would be afraid to face the truth and would start looking at the sins of others in order to console yourself.
You hate sin in itself, but in a sense you love it, as loving God's will to leave you with it. It is not the sin you love, but God's will. And the proof that you have the right disposition is that you turn away from the sin.
COMMENT: So when I fall I believe that God's goodness is mine.
You can know what a truth is without knowing its properties. You can know the mercy of God without knowing that its effect is to rectify your natural desire for God. So if you don't believe in the natural goodness of your actions, you can't believe in God's mercy, because it might still seem that His mercy couldn't rectify your actions. So our elevation to the divine life is the fulfillment of nature. If you deny our participation in God's divine life, you can't fulfill nature.
COMMENT: We always thought of this participation in the divine life as something extraneous.
This participation makes the fulfillment of your natural desires more complete.
COMMENT: Participation in God’s divine life doesn't make any sense at all if you don't believe you have those natural desires.
If you don't have these natural desires, you don't have anything in you which is receptive to God's life. The reality of God's mercy is that He is directing your natural desires to Him more and more completely, and He permits your evil as a way of drawing you. That is the meaning of sin.
COMMENT: We were always forced to be good because we thought our natural desires were bad.
It is very important to rectify your conscience and to believe in yourself, because if you think what you want is fundamentally evil, you won't look at yourself as an object of faith. This is also the secret of fraternal charity, because when you look at yourself that way, you look at your neighbor in the same way. But if you try to support yourself with that muted despair, you’ll consciously or unconsciously try to see that your neighbor is the same way or worse. Remember Jesus said, "Cast the beam out of your own eye and then you will know how to heal your neighbor."(Mt 7:5; Lk 6:42)
COMMENT: You really use psychology in explaining things to us. Psychiatrists explain it, but they can't do anything about it.
They're trying to convince you that you're alright in yourself. The right conclusion should be that with the grace of God you can become right. But what we have is psychology without faith and faith without psychology.
COMMENT: The point is that even though it is true that my natural desires are good, I have done cockeyed things and there is still the fact that I like to do those things.
What is "natural" is good in the sense that your desire for God is good. A homosexual is looking for the love of a father, and naturally the love of a father is good. But in psychiatry the whole operation is neurotic, because the psychiatrist cooperates in repressing the evil, whereas in the faith you can handle the evil, because with the help of God's grace, you rectify the natural desire for good and in Jesus fulfill those very desires.
COMMENT: People say there is a fundamental goodness in man and then they go beyond that and say that they can do it themselves; they would deny our fallen nature.
If they were able to do this, to deny our fallen nature, it would make Christ unnecessary. If we could be good without elevation to God's divine nature, why would he have had to die on the Cross? The process by which we become holy is through sin and the acknowledgement of sin. If you don't see that you're a sinner and fallen in yourself, then what would stop you from just resting in yourself? On the other hand, if you see that you're just evil, why try? The only right resolution is to believe in the fundamental goodness of your natural appetite, that you really want to love God and your neighbor, and that Christ makes it possible. You realize by this objectivity how you are fallen in yourself, and at the same time you believe that Christ is enabling you to fulfill your natural desires.
If we look at the whole breakdown of morality in our time, I think God lets that happen to teach us the things we’re learning here: this idea of believing in your own goodness, in Jesus, and in the goodness of your natural desires. You have to believe in the rightness and goodness of your natural desires and that they can be fulfilled in Christ. Then the meaning of your perversity is simply to bring you closer to Jesus. Otherwise you’ll conclude that you want evil and so you’ll do it.
COMMENT: Is each moment, then, the divine life that Jesus is offering us to fulfill those natural desires? That's really a great way to look at it! I never saw it that way before.
There is a story about three monks, and they wanted to find out which one was a saint, so they asked them what they would do if they knew they were going to die. The first one said he would go to the chapel and pray; the second one said he would examine his conscience and go to confession; but the third one said he would go on doing whatever he was doing - he was the saint.
Believing in yourself also gives you that dignity and self-respect. Ask yourself how much of what you do is to sell yourself to others. Also, ask yourself why you look for evil in others.
COMMENT: When you believe in yourself you really want to stay in Jesus.
You don't say, I'm going to stay recollected. You know that if you're not recollected. you’ll get in trouble. With the real sinner the only trouble with temptation is that it doesn't last long enough! But when you live in Jesus, you want the good He wants and all your natural desires are fulfilled in Him.